Ethnographic Interviews
Florin Firimita
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Florin Firimita is a Romanian-born visual artist, writer, and high school educator specializing in mixed media collages and photography. After fleeing his home country during the fall of communism in 1989, he made his home in the United States. His art is deeply influenced by his personal history, reflecting themes of survival, identity, and the refugee experience, often interwoven with iconography that evokes his childhood. As both an artist and a storyteller, Firimita's work seamlessly blends visual and linguistic narratives, highlighting his profound appreciation for the power of storytelling across mediums.
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Interview Transcription:
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A: How has your personal mental health journey influenced the themes and narratives in your artwork?
F: When I used to paint I felt disconnected because I used to paint very traditionally. Another still life, another still life. That wasn’t interesting anything but now I’m like this where I finished that collage there and I’m not thinking about all the stuff in the news. Sometimes that shows up in photography work. I did a thing where I broke 50 plates and I did this circle - I have a things with targets lately, about vulnerability - I put this woman in the center of it and we spent a couple hours arranging with it. She was shot from above like in the center of (the plates). Things like that that are vulnerable but strong like that. During the pandemic I did stuff with a friend of mine who's a ballerina. I bought 200 eggs and she had to wear the pointe shoes and we destroyed a couple eggs but the goal here was to find balance and we set them up like a target. I think the best work which doesn’t always happen is when it’s connected to what I’m worried about or what I’m thinking about.
A: Do you see your creative process as therapeutic or meditative? Why or why not?
F: It’s gotta be but that’s not the premise. The primary thing is the need to make stuff. It’s almost like post November 6th all of a sudden it’s like I gotta get my hands dirty so I’m working with mixed media. I can see things that I wanna address. I don’t think of the therapy that way but doing it is that way.
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A: How do you channel your emotions into your work, and what impact does that have on your mental well being?
F: The targets, you know where that came from? Women’s productive rights. That’s what I was bothered by, this stuff. And now do you read that in there? No. And I’m gonna do some stuff with women and targets on them and stuff because it bothered me about older white men making decisions about women’s bodies. Or like war. There’s so much pollution and we contribute to that. All this constantly and constantly. I think when you make art and if you pay attention and listen it helps you see things in a clearer way.
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A: Shifting from artist to educator a little bit, have you noticed a difference with students’ mental health and well being when they engage in art making ?
F: Oh definitely. It’s a safe place to be. Anything that has to do with creativity, music writing this or basically being allowed to get your hands dirty and do stuff. Out of that becomes a trust, you know they tell me stuff they don’t tell their counsellors and they put it on their work. And I’m good with that because otherwise you bottle it up and boom. It’s gotta be a safe place and we’re able to keep that space for them. It’s not about making stuff but it’s about having that kind of pulse of, an expanding pulse of the consciousness that you can breathe versus taking tests. You don’t learn anything from testing.
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A: How do you think art allows individuals, regardless of skill level, to process emotions and improve their mental health?
F: Skills are the least important thing. Unless you go for that, the process is more than just “can you make a mark?” So the skills, you’ll catch up with the skills, but I think the ability to open up and then the ability to turn the faucet on for this stuff and the skills will come.
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A: Your art incorporates text, layers and symbolism. How do these elements reflect mental health struggles or healing processes?
F: I think so because I read a lot and maybe that stuff transfers into it. I did a series years ago where I ask people to write three letters, close friends, one letter to somebody that they wish to meet, somebody who passed away, somebody who they love or something like that. I turned those graphic things and used bits and pieces from that. I like to do that in terms of, not to explain the work, but to enhance in a way. Don’t show and tell but tell to show. If there’s any text there’s gotta be some graphic quality. You don’t want to read the painting, you just want bits and pieces.
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A: Growing up in Romania and immigrating to the US, how have cultural shifts impacted your mental health and the stories you tell through your work?
F: There was more of that in the beginning. The weird thing when I first came here for years and years I used to paint landscapes from Romania from my imagination which was very strange. As a way of connecting. They’re all sold now but I keep thinking “what was I trying there?” but I think it was a way of keeping like postcards from something. So I think the connection was more of something like in Romania everything stopped with Van Gogh. Everything else was censored after that. When I came here I was like kid in a candy shop. Museums and stuff it definitely was a huge change. I’ve been an American longer than Romanian so I don’t really crave for anything, but it’s the fact that the way I grew up and artists and reading. My best art classes were in high school not college. I think as I get farther away from when I came here. So like now I’m worried, or not worried, I’m paying attention to this country and what’s happening. Women’s reproductive rights, censorship, banning books - that’s another thing that’s bothering me. Because this is my country now.
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A: Does sharing your work, which can often feel very personal, ever feel mentally challenging? If so, how do you manage that vulnerability?
F: It doesn’t feel, you know it’s a good type of vulnerability. It is what it is. I don’t look for approval and when I submit things to shows, if I get accepted, it’s good, if I get rejected, it’s good. Somebody buys the work, it’s good. I destroy the work, it’s good. I’m not really out seeking those kinds of things. I’m totally comfortable with all that.
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A: How do you face things like creative block?
F: I was doing photography for awhile and it wasn’t really going where I wanted it to go. I wanted to address certain things with mixed media. So I shift. If I couldn’t do photography then I would go into writing. If I couldn’t go into writing then I would go into mixed media. It’s kind of a luxury. I’m not saying I’m good at those things, I just have two modes I can use so then it’s kind of like I jump on this, or I jump on this or that one. It’s kind of like my brain is going all the time, it’s not like I have to really sort it out it’s more like waiting for something to come to me. When I’d feel like in a rut in terms of mixed media, I spent like twelve years making art writing a novel. It’s not like it’s planned, it’s just like if I hear voices saying sit down and write, I gotta do that. If I gotta get my hands dirty and then I gotta do that. It’s never really been like a struggle.
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A: What advice would you give students or emerging artists who would like to use art as a tool to improve their mental health and well being?
F: Keep doing it. Put yourself out there. Have the courage, well I don’t know that courage is the word. Trust yourself that it doesn’t matter how it comes out. Just do it because it’s probably one of the few things
that are personal , I mean what else do we have? Relationships and that, everything else is external. Keep doing it without thinking about how it looks, just do it.
Kimberly Saginario​
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​Kimberly Saginario is a dedicated elementary art teacher with over 16 years of teaching experience. With a background in fashion design, Kimberly brings her creative flair and industry knowledge into the classroom, inspiring young students to explore their artistic potential. Her passion for art education shines through her engaging lessons, which emphasize creativity, self-expression, and a love for the arts.​
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Interview Transcription:
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A: How long have you been teaching and what got you into teaching?
S: I’ve been an art educator for sixteen years. One year was in high school and that included an alternative high school setting. And then the other fifteen were all elementary. And I got into it -- I was a fashion designer for five years right out of college working in New York City. I was talented I think, I made money, but it just wasn't very satisfying. I spent a long time, it took maybe a year, trying to figure out what would be a better fit.
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A: How does art impact students' emotions during class?
S: I don’t know. I think from what I can tell, I teach elementary so I can have anywhere from a 4 year old to an 11 year old. They seem pretty starved for the labor of it. They want to work with their hands. Over the years, I think trend wise, they want us to integrate other subject areas or heavy on the art history, heavy on the visual literacy but now I just feel like that’s not what they need in terms of mental health and well being or development. It’s not so much mental health but the little kids have physical needs that have to be met and they’re kinda not being met because they’re in school all day. Part of me is like I can let them get to work right away as soon as possible and they are very very happy to do that.
A: Have you noticed changes in students’ behavior through art?
S: If there is something very wrong, and I don’t always know what that is but I have seen over 1500 students in my time, they will express that through art and sometimes it has to pushed to a higher professional than me in terms of mental health. I have one boy who is a good artist and he likes it, his behavior is not wonderful
but if he’s engaged he’s fine. And then I’ll give back work the next class and he’ll just give me eye contact and just rip it up right in front of my face, even though it was good. I’m not always sure what they do and why they do it but once in a while - I see more negative emotions come out in art because the bulk of it is positive. So when you see something negative it catches your attention that there might be a mental health issue going on. Then you can talk to other teachers, the school psychologist and get better insight. The other nice thing about htat too in terms of helping children, is that you have a solid piece of paper or artwork to show them “look this is what that kid put in their artwork and I’m concerned.” It’s something tangible.
A: Does creating art help students manage stress?
S: You’re gonna want to say yes, right? Just like we want art to improve test scores. It depends on the kid because again, I’m thinking of my age groups, if you have a kid with anxiety it’s not really diagnosable at a young age. So if they’re going to have anxiety at a later age, maybe art i awful for them because they’re a perfectionist and this is just triggering to them. It’s so difficult because it’s such a broad - it depends because there’s another kid I have, I don’t even know the term, it’s so rare, just mute? Selective mutism. This is great for him, right? Art is great for him. He’s cute and smiles and seems happy to do it because he’s not verbal. But kids that get frustrated or maybe even on the autism spectrum can’t do what they wanna do. Subject matters are controlled, maybe mediums are controlled. They get frustrated sometimes. So it’s not always a yes, I wish it was.
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A: What kinds of art activities best support student well-being?
S: I would say, if that is the goal, something that is not modeled by the teacher or there is not an example for them to look at or copy or strive for. Not a guided drawing. It would have to be process oriented. Probably non-representational if you really want that to be the goal which it can be. I wanna say clay but again, that can be triggering for some.
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A: How do group art projects affect social interactions?
S: That could be a really positive effect of a group project. It would be difficult, it would be appropriate for middle school, I think. But, like for elementary, I could see the potential for that being extremely positive for connection, especially art clubs and stuff like that tend to do those types of projects. And then having a club in of itself and also creating work together would definitely contribute.
A: What challenges do you face in using art to support mental health?
S: I’m gonna say the support afterward. I can support your mental health and well being but someone else has to be prepared for what comes out. Maybe someone, and little kids will do this, like we have a transgender child right now. Some kids might identify as gay through their artwork if you do something like this. There might be evidence of sexual abuse in their artwork. This has all happened to me. The only reason I know the sexual abuse stuff, it’s not even explicit. It’s not what you would think. But I remember from those old textbooks, like oh my gosh, I need to bring this to someone’s attention. I’ve done it before where it’s like “look at this and look at their other behavior, and now look at this” someone’s gotta look into this and I’ll call 211 myself if I need to but there needs to be someone to support me because I’m not an art therapist. I’m an art teacher and I’m not certified in art therapy or any kind of therapy so, you can do that stuff but you need a net.
A: How do you ensure art projects are more therapeutic than stressful?
S: If it becomes stressful at the elementary level then no, someone needs to step in. At the elementary level if it is becoming stressful they’ll ruin it, they’ll shut down, they'll hate art, they’ll cry. You really have to help them and if they’re stuck on one spot, it might mean drawing on their artwork, cutting and gluing the thing they’re stuck on so that they can move on. Because what are you assessing them on? You know, like if they hit one little speed bump and they absolutely can’t get past it, we don’t want it to be stressful. The art tech class I teach, this happened a lot. As long as they try, because there is something with little kids to learn helplessness. If they try three times and they’ll come up to me with tears in their eyes and their voices shake and “no no no, we’re not, I’m not gonna let you be upset about this. Let me do this for you then you can try the next step with everyone.” I think there is a point where you have to step in and help them get past it. You could also have a really really gifted artist and it happens to those kids. Those gifted kids are used to high achievement everywhere and they might have a vision which is great because envisioning is a strong sophisticated skill, but if their artwork is not coming out to according to their vision, can they start over? Well I don’t want to set that precedent that you can just start over because I go through 20,000 sheets of paper a year, but maybe this kid can start over. If you’re learning something new, like new materials, it’s all new to us, so there might be a point where you have to jump in.
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A: Which art forms or materials seem most beneficial for mental health?
S: Paint and clay all day long. With my age group, the paint, even if they just take it and satisfy their sensory need and end up with an olive green piece of paper, next time it’ll be different. They really love paint, they love it. And then they also love clay, neither of those are possible all the time but it’s important to give everyone a chance to touch all of it.
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A: What role should art play in supporting mental health at school?
S: I think, it’s not up to the art teacher. It’s not. We’re not trained in it. I wouldn’t treat art class like anything for mental health. There is a student and I only go to this school for the art tech class and he was talking to me about his art therapy. I was like “oh my gosh tell me more I wanna know about it.” What they do is so different. If it’s about mental health it’s not about the finished project. He was like “I painted these mountains or trees and large, small, medium and each one was representational of an obstacle I could get over. So it’s more about like the concept a therapist is trying to give him and then it just so happened that painting it on a canvas was the best way to show that concept. Instead of the other way around. What you could do if an art tacher wanted it to be a focus they could backbone it with children’s book and literature that already exists. I do that with culture and history myself so if a parent’s lie “why is my child coming home with this liberal woke stuff.” I’m just like “oh it’s in this book, I got it from the library.” You could do it that way if you really want to. There’s this one lesson I do with Kindergarten and it’s about worry, but you absolutely had to read the book first. This scribbly line that was teh worry and it followed this girl wherever but then the art project was to think about a worry and make a scribbly line with marker and then at the end you rip them all up and make a rainbow collage with the scribbles. It was really effective but that’s as far as I’d go. It actually maybe is appropriate for an older class because colleges want to see that and maybe by then their issues have hopefully been worked on. But with my littles, 120 a day, and a lot of them only learned to walk or talk 4 years ago and maybe trauma hasn’t happened yet.
